If anyone's interested and wants to hear more, I have a mix of 92/93 era Jungle [1]
Some rough mixes here and there (especially the first one) because it was live from a NYE event. But it suits the style of music, that era was so raw and fresh, the future was being invented right there! Very happy days :)
> that era was so raw and fresh, the future was being invented right there! Very happy days
I've been told by several Gen-Z that they've never been to a "rave", and I feel sorry for them. In my town, we had quite the underground scene, but then times changed and it is so much smaller now. Now, "kids" just call it all EDM instead of the specific genre that we know and love.
There's still plenty of fresh underground music and the 'kids' are doing just fine. Yeah there's loads of mainstream garbage out there, but there always was. The main difference is that this stuff was being invented, whereas most electronic music now is derived from those early 90s invented genres, but even saying that there's still plenty of creativity.
There's a night in London called Cartulis (which is usually at Fold), when I go there it feels very much like the early rave scene to me (this is just one example, of course). I think there's a tendency when we get older to not be as exposed to the bubbling undercurrent of music, so it's easy to just say "it's not as good as it used to be", but that would be a mistake imho. It's there if you look for it.
I feel like with each new wave of music technology, people basically search the space for a while until the fruitful sub spaces are identified.
The novelty of the exploration is what is there the first time and not there in the future. You don’t know what’s going to sound good until someone happens to bump into it. You get surprises.
that new wave of technology meant that anyone with access to warez could create music for $0 instead of the thousands on buying synths and samplers. no more renting a truck to haul that gear to a gig; now it's just a laptop and/or tablet. new choons level achieved
Given when/where you were, you might be familiar with Global Underground. I was excited to learn recently that they relaunched in the past couple years www.globalunderground.co.uk
Global Underground never entirely went away. However, the famous label run by the “Boxed brothers” ran into severe financial difficulties in the early millennium. Since then, I have assumed that Global Underground is a mere brand that any prog-ish DJ can pay money to use, to aid in promotion.
I'm interested in a lot of subculture music, and it really isn't there like it was for the most part. Most families of music seem to have stagnated or regressed. The early 90s gangster rap is definitely superior to mumble rap/emo rap, the 90s IDM/jungle/trance is superior to modern EDM/house/trap and the pop mainstream now is just garbage compared to the the mainstream from the late 80s/90s.
Mixing and production are worlds better and musicianship has improved compared to where it was for genres where people care about musicianship, but the actual music is mostly either painfully derivative or actively worse because it's trying too hard to be "different."
Modern metal is amazing compared to the stuff from the 90s though.
I agree with you as far as Hip-Hop quality goes (assuming that "gangster" encompasses things like Old School East Coast, G-Funk, etc). There was a beauty in how limited the production assets of Hip-Hop were in those days, which fostered a very special kind of creativity. Not to mention how it intermixed with the afro-zeitgeist of that time.
But for example techno and house these days have such a gargantuan amount of variety. And because those genres were digital-ish to begin with, they didn't suffer as much from the evolution of DAWs compared to some other genres.
I don't agree. There are so many niche genres now that have never existed before, e.g. vaporwave, phonk, outrun, twee, etc. Gotta dig deeper. There is tons of fresh and original underground music being made still.
As a fan of both, I have to admit vaporwave and twee are both dead genres - although vaporwave has spawned a host of successor stuff, the great innovation there all happened a decade and more ago. Twee will always exist, but it's hardly a great example of a lively scene.
I miss the days of the regional scenes in music. These seem to be long past us now.
Using metal as an example; the 80’s and 90’s as an example had several distinct vibrant scenes, Bergen’s Black Metal, Gothenburg’s Melodeath, Tampa Bay’s Death Metal, as examples. All distinct and vibrant with a period of sustained development with a cluster of artists who seemed to circulate and work off each other.
Today it feels easier to connect with others globally with music genres we like, but it’s almost as if this homogenises the art we produce in a sense.
A core collection of 20-40 artists and musicians working and operating in isolation (comparative to now), sharing what they enjoy, spinning it and innovating it to something new.
To genericise it and bring it back to the core of this place - In a sense one relate these scenes in a way to areas with a particularly strong start-up scene, albeit more freeform and wholly artistic in their endeavours.
Long gone are the days of "shoes in the dryer" mixes where guys were just slamming two DATs together with no pitch control. Sadly, I think we've gotten to the point of those tight mixes being less of the skill of the DJ and the result of software. With everything being done on laptops with cool software, I really wonder how many DJs are even mixing and just performing while a premixed file plays.
But as you say, the production quality has definitely improved. The music is just clean with no quality loss from layering/multi-tracking/bouncing. The concept of the space between notes has never been so distinguished.
Honestly as someone that learnt to mix many years ago on vinyl, the technical skill required to do this well doesn't translate into a better experience for the people dancing. It's not a rock concert with a performer, there's no need to look at the DJ anyway. I care infinitely more about the DJs creative sensibility than their beatmatching skill.
99.99999% of DJs have been performing a premade mix since iPods have become popular. The knob twiddling DJs are hilarious. Ukraine, oddly, seems to be pumping out tons of attractive women dancing off beat behind setups that aren’t even powered on half the time on YouTube. I enjoy the mixes in the background while working and occasionally watch some footage for the laughs. Shake it if you’ve got it.
As always, it depends on what style you're talking about. For mainstream EDM? Sure I won't fight your figure. But for underground techno (among many others), you're delusional if you think the majority of djs play pre-recorded mixes.
So many absolutely ignorant people who are just dying to accelerate their degeneration into some sort of grumpy misogynist old man at a premature age in this comment section.
No. If you are in a serious electronic music scene, nobody is playing premade mixes off their ipods. All the clubs I go to only have just an upgraded version of the same CDJs that were being released in the early 2000s. We mix tracks we bought on sites like bandcamp and beatport on professional equipment. The crowd is educated and would throw someone out of the whole scene if they actually started playing a premade mix.
Those people who fake it make social media videos that go viral with people who spend their time online and have never been to a real rave or underground club (or who go to commercial EDM events - which are not representative of the booming underground) - nobody in the scene actually listens to that stuff and theres a lot of us. None of them would ever get booked at a serious event.
And, for the record, there is a boatload of very talented, super attractive female DJs in the scene and they DJ manually. Most of the vinyl only Djs that I've seen live were female and they weren't ugly either to make up for their femaleness. I know you think a woman can only be talented if she hides her distracting attractiveness.
Check your ignorance when you're clearly not in the loop of the scene.
I'm not going spend my time collating links to help you when you say it like that. They're not unicorns. Nobody in the techno scene plays pre recorded sets and women are no more liable to do it than men. I'm sorry that you're uninformed and sexist. Maybe change your attitude a bit and we can talk.
Fr. Don't know why you're getting downvoted. The bitter people in this comment section who think electronic music died in the 90s clearly wouldn't know a good club if it slapped them in the face and it shows.
Again. Going to a festival does not mean you're going to a good one. Most of the best music happens in clubs in the underground circuit anyway not at "burns", which sounds like the most gentrified, millenial techbro yuppie garbage I've ever heard and I'm unsurprised you're not finding the bleeding edge of underground rave music there.
The key word is GOOD. Not that you just go places bro. You're clearly unsatisfied with the music you're hearing at these events. SO FIND BETTER ONES.
Tell me you're out of the loop without telling me you're out of the loop. As someone in my mid 20s, techno music is booming and it has zero EDM/house/trap influences. Everyone my age thinks EDM is cringe, it was a trend of 10 years ago. Go to actually underground sound clubs if you know where they are. I'm guessing you don't, because you're showing how ignorant you are of the scene. Some recently released tracks I picked up as a young techno DJ just in the last few weeks/months:
Bro talks to me like I don't know what Drumcode is. The biggest titan in techno music to the point that people literally call it "business techno" because it's so oversaturated. Yeah I know drumcode. I know who Derrick May is, I don't know what sort of thumb-sucking 14 year old you think you're talking to. Derrick May is not by any stretch of the imagination a purely minimal techno artist. He literally made Strings of Life which is one of the least fucking minimal things I've ever heard.
You're right, minimal techno is not the most popular form of techno right now. That's not a new thing that happened in this decade though. Techno has been going through trends of being faster and more maximalist vs slower and minimalist since it began. I'm sorry that you're struggling to find minimal techno nights to your liking, I'm sure there are some out there and I'm sure the trend will come back around. But the techno of my generation is not all EDM or trap influenced so I know you're talking out your ass. You may have been to many techno events in your life, but what you're saying here just proves you're out of the loop like many nostalgic oldheads. So maybe just take a step back and consider that you may have lost touch with the underground. You certainly have if you think drumcode is an underground reference these days.
When you're condescending and make bad faith arguments, people will find you frustrating. I'm not sure why you want to emulate your grandparents by dismissing younger people's creativity just like they did to you. Open your mind a bit and try not to become the people you hated.
Edit: Festivals have never been the beating heart of the techno scene my friend. I'm sorry to break it to you. And again, I've been to good festivals which do play this stuff - you clearly don't know where to go and you're taking it out on my generation when its on YOU.
I didn't intend someone taking away from that no fresh music was being made. I simply said that the parties of old are no longer happening, so that experience isn't available to them.
I'm constantly listening to new music, and I've come up with lots of new tracks that will make a helluva set list, one day. Problem I have is only owning 1200s, and none of the gear to let those drive digital files. My discretionary funds for gear has evolved into other things so buying the right equipment gets pushed lower on the priority list
Rave culture is alive and well in the UK - free parties several days a week around Bristol and south Wales. Old heads and the younguns collaborating usually.
I can second Vancouver, and will raise you any big city in the USA - most of Latin America as well. Only thing that changes as usual is regionally based music tastes, though I find that people actually dance a hell of a lot more outside the anglosphere
Europe is a given but I hear Asia is popping off too. I have friends in Oceania who do some work around the scene. Really it's all over the world, people never stopped partying it just goes a little more underground here and there
Those are the best places these days. It sucks when clubs get closed in urban areas but there's still plenty of parties happening where you're bothering nobody, and nobody will bother you.
I think I'm at the age where I'm more interested in participating as someone actually creating part of the entertainment if I'm going to feel like I'm having the best time though, I think that's probably the best way for anyone to get into it. Lots of volunteer opportunities at festivals and of course paid gigs you can do. If you're a programmer, maybe getting deep into visuals is a way you can have some fun contributing too.
There are raves happening in warzones and even places you think there would be authoritarian crackdowns like China
I've not found that to be the case, though I'm only casually interested these days (too old to feel comfortable at most events, worried I'm more there to relive the good old days than a 'genuine' interest etc).
With dB festival gone, do people just hit up showbox or monkey loft shows and try to make friends?
19hz has a good listing of events. A lot of it is announced on Instagram or Telegram (or the old classic of looking at the fliers on the telephone poles of cap hill). Renegades still happen (the bridge has been a super popular spot) but that season is sorta over. I more favor the Kremwork (that's more my scene) or digital hardcore shows which seem to just pop up everywhere.
Awesome stuff thanks, as to kremwork I wasn't aware they'd survived little marias closing - glad to hear some culture is left in the city. Funny to hear of it via HN but hey small world.
It is. You want to give me your or buy me one? ;-) I never said it wasn't a thing, only that my discretionary fund for such things prevents me for purchasing them.
I was surprised to see Gen Z called out here specifically, though I guess it depends on where you live/grow up as well. I'd hazard to guess most of the millennials I know also haven't been to a rave!
I don't think there were any available in my hometown (or they were too underground for me to have ever heard about!), and there wasn't much exposure to electronic music at all, so it's not an experience I'd ever considered trying to find out how to have.
Just one person's anecdote, of course, but I wonder what the balance of generation vs. location is!
It's just the specific conversations I've had. I'm in the GenX group, and partied with lots of millennials. Based on that experience I just rolled millennials into the "hasRaved == true" category. While never attending a full on rave, my kid has at least attended our old park parties we'd throw during the day with permits and everything. She'd be an elder GenZ, so at least she was introduced to the concept. These other conversations I've had haven't even had that.
Can confirm. I imagine that it's highly localized, but the closest I got was dances at anime conventions and more mainstream venues that might play Jersey/Baltimore Club.
Per TFA, most of my exposure music that's now put under the EDM umbrella was through video games (DDR...). Also mix-discs curated from Limewire downloads, keygens, Windows Movie Maker AMVs, and the Newgrounds/Youtube/Bandcamp releases of amateur FruityLoops producers.
I suppose what might make this paradigm interesting to consider is that it means most of this music was a contributing element to some larger project, and not just something to enjoy on its own (though you could make the case that music at a rave is just a means to forging social and emotional connections). As such, there are a lot of songs that people my age will recognize immediately, and absolutely could not tell you who made them (just where they heard it first).
As a jungle fan since the 90s, don't spout that offensive nonsense ;)
Seriously, there are marked differences between the two other than BPM that make them sound very distinctive (and D&B typically boring to me as a result) - generally, jungle is heavily syncopated and makes more uses of chopped samples vs D&B which tends to be sequenced fairly straight and makes more use of programmed drums.
the local police here formed a Rave Task Force. it became very effective, and pretty much killed the scene. it got to the point where the cops would show up as the guys were unloading the PA from the truck. lots of cat and mouse games followed on trying to get past the cops. promoters even started lining up alternate locations to relocate if something got shut down. then the cops started threatening to use crack house laws to arrest the promoters for providing a place for drugs to be used. we don't have clubs to speak of and mainly just bars. we tried doing events at bars, but having to shut down at 2am is just a joke.
It's just not a real rave until the cops cut the tunes and flip on the the house lights at 3AM. Then you get to run the gauntlet of berries and cherries while saucered and blowed. I do miss what I remember of the '90s.
Cops. Pfftt. Wait till it’s an outdoor event where the entire sheriff’s department rolls up, and all the deputies are holding shotguns watching everyone load back up in their cars to leave. Or when the ghetto bird is loitering overhead with the spot light just to scare the party kids.
I know the artist that made the image* used for the inside jacket for the Prodigy says it wasn’t about rave culture, but it’s still one of my favorite counter culture images.
Yup, exactly this. In the city I'm thinking of it was a municipal bylaw allowing for obscene 5-figure fines for anyone organizing a rave, even it was just the DJ they grabbed. The scene withered after that.
Damn! The Progression Session albums, the third one in particular, are absolutely amazing. When the album rolls in to Track #2, 'Big Bud - Pure', with him and DRS ... it's just magical.
Wild, have a great time! Low-key jealous. Passed so much time spinning Bukem and MC Conrad during long hacking sessions, made for a perfect atmosphere. Too bad you can’t see them together anymore, RIP.
Additionally, a lot of jungle music were produced on Amiga using the same tracker software as many demosceners (OctaMED, ProTracker, etc). Makes me curious of how many junglists were also active sceners :-)
Having a few random mixes of yours I've (somehow) collected over the years amongst others, I didn't expect to click through a random Soundcloud link and see your name.
One of the things I noticed with a bunch of the younger producers is that they make really nice tunes but they don't bother with the whole intro/outro thing so there's no buffer on either end of the track to mix the thing unless you go add them yourself before even attempting to get them in with a bunch of older choons meant for mixing. like this is great [1], but 1:34 minutes lmao what? On the other hand people who have been at it since the very early days are still quietly releasing alot, here's some secret dillinja cuts [2]
OP, the link you provided keeps redirecting me to the Google Play store to install the SoundCloud app, no matter what browser I use to open it. Could you please create a link which stays on the SoundCloud website? Not everyone wants to use apps on mobile just because some service wants to force you to use them.
In general please don't use Soundcloud to share music. It's complete shit. It doesn't even allow seeking unless you register for an account. At least Youtube is borderline usable without signing in.
Soundcloud is one of the last bastions of creator-driven music hosting - I’m happy to support the platform given how useful it is to the indie community. There’s a myriad of mixes and tunes on there that would simply never exist or be found on other platforms.
Are you kidding? Not only does YT push undesired video bloat when you just want to listen to audio, it also is ad-driven/-ladden. Basically using YT for audio and Let's Play binging is an Alzheimer/Boomer marker, and the signal to leave the party.
Is using uBlock Origin or NewPipe, which have made YouTube an ad-free experience for more years now than I can remember, a “Boomer marker”? Granted, it isn’t unusual to see claims in tech circles that younger generations today are less aware of certain customizations or certain forms of pirating content, but it would be a real shame.
Hell yeah, I've been listening to jungle mixes on YouTube since this summer and enjoying Jungle Fatigue on Bandcamp. My introduction to jungle-esque music was Toonami so it's been fun exploring this genre more.
I've been having a lot of fun learning trackers as a little hobby in the past year with a cheap portable midi keyboard and some samples to play around with. There's just so many resources to learn from these days on youtube which didn't exist 5-10 years ago and I guarantee you if you have the time for it you can go from downloading renoise and a bunch of samples to bumping out some songs within a week or two of learning. There's also a lot to be said for the kind of sound you get out of older hardware, you have kids who are like 20 years old picking up these things and doing shit like emulating the DSP in there to create a VST for use on modern systems for those who don't want to drop a bunch of money on getting an amiga 500 shipped to their door [1], but you also have people pretty much just doing that and busting out octamed or protracker. Lots of cool clips out there [2]. If anyone is looking to have some fun with all this I suggest bizzy b's channel [3], the 'groovin in g' channel [4], as well as stranjah's channel on youtube [5]
Really the best sound test is done on a few things though, you also want to see how it sounds on whatever consumer audio solutions you have sitting around (the car especially is a good test)
Got me started on watching University Challenge, and now Cosmic Pumpkin is one of my very few "must watch new videos right away" subscriptions on YouTube.
I have to recommend digging into the story behind the person who used to upload UC episodes to YouTube before Cosmic Pumpkin, and the reason that they stopped uploading. Google "Dave Garda", I don't think anyone has done an authoritative writeup but it's a wild one.
I knew vague outlines of it from YouTube comments, now searched it up and found a reddit post that explains it more. It would be a bizarre story if it was fiction: uploading (and participating in) quiz telecasts, to faking one's identity and scamming people via charity, is such a weird pipeline. But real life's messy like that, I imagine he probably starting to upload things as a genuine fan originally, and then changed as a person over the course of the years to end up being a scammer.
The very best of jungle was "UK Apache with Shy FX - Original Nuttah". It got a bit of re-release for its 25th birthday (5 years ago) with an intro by Idris Elba.
I can't accept Drum and Bass, we need Jungle I'm afraid.
Genuinely glad I got to experience so much of it growing up with a PS1 and the genre's stuck with me. If you want to focus on listening or have some soothing background noise, it's perfect, versatile.
While not all jungle, shouout to PS1 racing games for their killer soundtracks. The glorified mixtape of Gran Turismo 2 (all versions!), Colin Mcrae Rally's acid beats, everything in Ridge Racer. Really feels like vidya soundtracks peaked there.
Going from carts to CDs, so much more storage. I've got a great collection of retro (at least from my childhood) games going and PS1 is my favourite, got a big stack
I have been going through a heavy jungle phase recently thanks to these mixes I found when investigating what's possible on the Commodore A600 (I recently came into possession of one):
It's a channel called "off1k", and a playlist called "Jungle / Drum & Bass", and all the tunes come from people making music on Amigas in the early 90s on software called "protracker".
A600s, A1200s, maybe others, maybe other versions or variants of protracker, I'm not sure. Anyway, if someone can get through 30s of mix 1 without losing their sh*t, I want to hear about it, I'll keel over.
And, to top it all off, about a week in to these mixes on loop, I ask myself: what is that software? Is that still going? And I discover some fellow called "Olav Sørensen" recently wrote an identical-looking protracker clone:
https://16-bits.org/pt2.php
EDIT: GH link https://github.com/8bitbubsy/pt2-clone
Which I can confirm runs very smoothly on Arch (btw). It says it's available for Mac and Windows on the site. In the words of the sample from the first track on mix 1: "annihilating the rhythm". Get jungling people!
Related to this is the Buck Bumble[1] theme song[2]:
> “That’s the whole point of it, we didn’t want to do sort of boring techno stuff as well, or jungle, so we picked speed garage, it’s funkier than house and garage.”[3]
I was surprised Unreal Tournament didn't get a mention in the article — it's famous for its music! I fondly remember several of its tracks falling within this genre.
I'd argue the article gets the history of jungle itself quite wrong too... there's no mention of breakbeat hardcore, no mention of Shut Up and Dance collaborating with Ragga Twins, etc.
Fabio and Grooverider are seminal figures to the scene, yes, but they did not originate the sound.
The sidebar about pirate radio, while factually correct, seems to heavily imply that pirate radio started in the jungle era, but Radio Caroline was broadcasting in the 60s
Hi there. That was probably just a small mistake on how I tried to explain the paragraph or the poor choice of words/terms I used. Thanks for the heads up.
I've had this argument too many times, and it's not worth repeating. Yes, techno is from Detroit, influenced by Kraftwerk, influenced by Stevie Wonder, influenced by Stockhausen etc etc. Where it comes from is defined by where you draw a line in the sand.
Influenced by DJ Kool Herc more than any of those, I would wager.
I was AFK all night after posting this, but I actually regret not acknowledging international contributions to techno music and culture, which was and is huge.
But I can't agree with this:
> Where it comes from is defined by where you draw a line in the sand.
There was a time before anyone called music 'techno', and a time after. That's the line, and the part of history which crossed that line happened in the Detroit Metro area. There's no disputing this.
Techno parties are all about having a good time and welcoming everyone, no matter who they are or where they're from. The music is absolutely a blend of influences from all over, and Germans took to it (hard!) for a reason. But roots is roots.
I totally agree that there's no disputing the origin of techno, but personally I'm not convinced it matters much to the broader history of jungle. Two reasons: house predates techno by several years; and the historical connection from house to jungle is a bit easier to trace than any influence of Detroit techno.
Both Chicago house and NYC/NJ Garage house developed in the early to mid 80s, whereas techno (as a term as well as a cohesive sound) didn't become a thing until the late 80s.
To be clear, I'm not trying to downplay the absolutely massive importance of the Belleville Three at all. But I would consider Juan Atkins' early work to be electro, rather than techno. And meanwhile Kevin Saunderson's best songs always felt more house-like than techno to my ear.
Anyway, jungle's most immediate predecessor was UK breakbeat hardcore, which combined breakbeats from funk and hip hop, with synth influences from acid house (Chicago) and new beat (Belgium), among other house-derived genres. I guess I just don't hear much of a techno influence in early jungle. In my view, that doesn't come in until some slightly later drum and bass subgrenres like techstep.
That all said, definitely agree that the timeline described in the article (which gave credit to Germany and the UK) is just plain wrong.
Thanks for the heads up. It's funny how we encounter different sources telling us different things about the history of these subgenres. I'll go back and review/expand that paragraph soon.
It seems quite silly to mention it, but the the phrase 'EDM' here really made me more upset than it possibly should. Call it 'House' genericlly, call it 'techno' generically, but please don't call it EDM generically, as that as many other's have mentioned is a sub genre coined way later to describe a bland watered down distant cousin of 'House' music. It really detracts from the great article in a Steve Buscemi with a skateboard kind of way.
this is also incorrect, EDM has multiple meanings over time and space - are you being annoyed at the contemporary American use of it to mean "inoffensive dance music"?
Agreed. EDM just means Electronic Dance Music. The issue is that it has also become the name of a generic genre of such music that is terrible and that is the visceral image most people get when you say the acronym. But that image is inaccurate.
Honestly it's more complicated than that. At the same time that techno was being created in Detroit, EBM was being created in Germany and the UK. When techno came back over from Detroit, it as influenced by those things. So modern techno can be said to have both European and African American roots independently. I would say its more accurate to say it originated in Detroit since that is the main basis for the sound, but it is extremely transatlantic.
cool to see ace combat 2 in there cause i love bullet hell games. was wild trying it on MAME instead of an arcade cabinet, hooked up to a subwoofer and realizing what genre it was cause your typical cabinet doesn't go loud enough to hear like half the song in the sub bass
also funny how you can beat the game as a dolphin flying a plane haha
Fun fact:
A high-quality prototype of the original PS1 Wipeout is shown in the movie Hackers (arcade scene). It was done on a high-end SGI server and allowed the dev team to try out tracks and gameplay before porting to the Playstation. There are features and graphics in the movie that do not exist in the actual game.
Ah, I'm glad the demoscene gets a mention. One does not make music on a computer in the 90s without at least some, or possibly a whole truckload of, influence from the demoscene.
I recall the Wipeout 2097 soundtrack[1] blew me away as a kid.
I had heard some techno and eurodance was popular at the time, but the sounds coming out of the speaker at the store where the demo ran was on another level.
Bought the CD and listen to it every now and then, and Orbital's Petrol track is still up there on my top 100 list.
There was something raw, and edge, that seems lost in so much electronic music these days.
Did you ever listen to the More Kombat follow on? Most of the tracks were forgettable, but there was that one track Space Man by Babylon Zoo that still runs through my head every now and again.
The "Spaceman" track was used in a Levi's ad[1] which used the intro. Then everyone went out and bought the single, and rocketed it up the charts in a lot of countries. At the time there was much disappointment that the rest of the song was not like that intro.
The edginess and rawness might be the limitations of the equipment used and the people using it, but for me the edge was that the music it wasn’t pigeonholed into different genres at the time. It was all working together like a Weatherall set.
Growing up, the music from PS1 games and getting my first computer with internet access sparked my interest in Drum and Bass, Jungle, and eventually other electronic music. In high school, I would spend hours every night searching for music and connecting with people who shared similar interests, discovering what they enjoyed. I also remembered going to Borders and spend hours browsing their library. It was a great time. I still have my drum and bass CDs from back then. Roni Size - New Forms was a game changer for me.
My favorite version of that song is General Levy's surprise guest appearance during a live Grime session[0]. The full 22 minutes are also worth a listen to, and this isn't even my type of music usually[1].
Absolutely! Like I said, normally I don't really connect with this kind of music. But I've noticed in general that really great live performances let me break through whatever it is that is normally "blocking" me. This set is an amazing example of that.
To me there is/was a natural connection between electronic music and game development just by the sheer involvement with technology. And jungle just happened to be very popular and going thru some major grassroots scene development around the same time. Personally, alongside earlier exposure to popular/underground dance music, my deeper exposure to electronic music came from tracker music and the demoscene which of course went hand in hand with developments in the game industry.
I've been playing a bit of 3d pinball space cadet last week and I kept thinking how the game sounds could fit wonderfully into breakcore and acid tekno tracks.
For easy listening jungle/Drum N Bass, excellent for work, search for "atmospheric drum n bass" or "liquid drum n bass". Artists: Photek, LTJ Bukem, DB (some), etc.
Best atmospheric mix w vocals ever: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAXnFZ3anlE
If you were part of the rave scene, you should watch the whole film, it's full of comedy and nostalgia of those hedonistic times. One of my all time favourite films.
Some excellent contemporary Jungle producers, if anyone wants recommendations: Dead Man's Chest, Tim Reaper, Equinox and Coco Bryce. These lads are producing bangers better, or on par, with the producers of the late 80s and 90s.
It's weird things like using "streaming" instead of "broadcasting", let alone the fact by the time Jungle was invented pirate radio was no longer happening on the seas but had moved to having the "studio" in one high rise block of flats with a point to point link to the actual broadcast site on another, coupled with the general structure and other fantasies makes me question how much of this was LLM generated. I couldn't continue reading after a while.
Hi there. Author here. Thanks for the heads up. I would never even consider using LLMs for this, this is just a subject that was always interesting to me so I thought it would be a good idea to write some of it down. Some of these mentions look like shortcomings of English not being my first language; I'll try to review it and change the words or terms that you suggested.
I do love that track, but although it takes the form of jungle it is utterly unlike jungle. Squarepusher is refined. Jungle is amateur. It needs to have the feel of "this is what we cafe because it's what we could make" whereas Squarepusher is grade 8 on at least two instruments. Love Squarepusher but he's not jungle.
The article mentions Bomberman on the Nintendo 64, but they made a mistake — there were actually 4 different Bomberman games on the Nintendo 64, and the one featuring Jungle music is Bomberman Hero, not the one whose box art they used (Bomberman 64).
I've recently been into game development, and I needed music which lead me to discovering synthesizers--I was hooked the first time I saw so many buttons, knobs, and flashing lights--and now I've gone off on a huge tangent and am studying music theory instead of making my game. Oh well, it's all for fun.
Does HN have any advice on how to get started with synthesizers, with an eye towards creating a game soundtrack?
For a more advanced set of lessons there is Syntorial, which has a demo including the first 20 or so lessons and the full set of 200 lessons for $120. Syntorial requires a download, but it's a full synthesizer with lessons built into it, so you can use it in your own music.
Aside from that I'd say youtube is the best source. While you're still a beginner I'd recommend avoiding any videos where they don't show the finished result because it's much harder to tell if the video is BS or not.
For free synthesizers, I'd recommend "TAL U-NO-60" as a good beginner one, it's modeled after the Roland Juno 60. And "Vital" for a more complex / less beginner friendly one. Both of those have paid versions with additional features but those additional features are not necessary at all. You'll also need a DAW software capable of loading VST plugins to use them.
You started in the right place with music theory. As for learning synths, you can do it in two ways - just start using them, fiddling and playing (whether its a software synth or hardware synth) or you learning actually the fundamentals by books, video and articles like these: https://www.soundonsound.com/series/synth-secrets-sound-soun...
I started the first way in the early 80s and did the second and have a life long love of synths ( I don't even know how many I have now but probably around 30-40 hardware synths, samplers and drum machines).
> I was hooked the first time I saw so many buttons, knobs, and flashing lights
I fell down the synthesizer rabbit hole during covid. And the urge to acquire more hardware is real. Resist! Try not to chase synth youtube gear cycles. Remember, synthesizers make sounds, not music. Not that there's anything wrong with enjoying sound design, it is fun. But if your goal is to make music, it can be a trap.
> Does HN have any advice on how to get started with synthesizers.
For me, synthesizers didn't click until I got my first super basic knob-per-function synth. There was just so many things I didn't know, that a VST like Vital had way too many options. Once I figured out most synths are just oscillators -> mixer -> filter -> amp, plus envelopes and LFO's for modulation... I could use pretty much any synth.
Once you understand those basics, maybe look at videos that show you how to recreate famous sounds. Probably start with simple classic sounds so you get a feel for how the synthesizer controls shape that sound.
Here is Anthony Marinelli showing you the bass sound from Madonna's Holiday in under 8m. He does a good job explaining why you use a certain setting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVedA7H4qpQ
My last piece of advice: the online synth community can be a bit toxic <cough>reddit</cough>. Ignore them and just do what feels fun. It's a hobby after all!
I think it's a rite of passage for every programmer to play with a DAW, contemplate a career in music, maybe even buy an expensive synth, make a bunch of boring beats, find out that it's just not the technical aspect but that you actually need to be musically creative. Then get discouraged when you meet a creative and talented musician who does more with less money and equipment. Like pretty much any guy that has played keyboards at a church service or a wedding using a freaking Casio.
I did this and know other devs who did this in the early 2000s lol.
Hardware synth route: Korg Minilogue XD is a great box that you'll likely keep forever. For a less traditional but fun experience, Arturia Microfreak or for more $, the Minifreak (which comes with a Minifreak VST!). To save money, see what's available second-hand locally and Google each to see if it's beginner friendly.
Software route: Get a midi controller with plenty of knobs and buttons that is supported for easy use by whatever DAW you want (digital audio workstation). By easy use, I mean that there is a config available within the DAW that will map the controller's buttons/knobs etc.to functions within the DAW. Examples: Push 3 or Launchkey keyboards for Abelton, Komplete Kontrol, etc.
If you want a lighter synth that is paired with a sequencer, drum machine, and effects all-in-one hardware box, for fun on the go or on your couch, you want a groovebox. I like the Novation Circuit Tracks, which has a serious synth under the hood, accessible by PC or a midi controller (Novation Launch Control XL is plug-n-play friendly if you download an addon from their website).
Ape Escape was mentioned. That game was released to promote the dual analog controller on Playstation 1. Back then the convention of camera control on right stick wasn't even established, so camera rotation was on the shoulder buttnos, while the right stick was used to control weapons!
Donkey Kong is peak jungle music (besides other music types (which is basically all of them)). Sometimes I imagine that when the first jungle evolved, it did so because it anticipated that Donkey Kong will eventually be created. As something inevitable. And so is the ocean, the tundra, pretty much everything. Sounds unlikely? Listen to the Soundtrack und think again. Something so beautiful, so magnificent, it's like the opus magnum of some higher being. Something for us to ponder about, to marvel at. Just like life itself.
Thank you for putting this together. For a certain generation this resonates strongly. For me in the mid to late 90's getting into coding and hacking assembly while listening to and coding underground music in trackers were huge influences that have had their impact on the trajectory of my life and my social circle.
I worked as an intern in the sound department at a video game company in 1997/1998. We had a full recording studio in house around the corner from my desk. One day, a drummer came in to lay down some drum’n’bass tracks for a game. So yeah, indeed the Jungle sound was present in video games back then. What a time.
There was a game called “SILENT THUNDER: A-10 TANK KILLER II” my father had in his collection that I’d ruffle through as a kid.
While the gameplay (brutal flight sim) wasn’t that compelling to child me, it had a full soundtrack made of multiple genres that lives in my brain to this day, especially “Monk’s revenge”. In fact, I think it was setup so that you could put the disk in a CD player and have it play as an audio disk. No idea if any of it counts as “jungle”, but it’s very much 90’s electronic game music.
Lots of games in that era just put the game data as track 1 and then filled the rest of the disc with audio tracks, so that they could command the disc player to handle all playback for them
Timecode step inside the zone. Out to the Moving Shadow crew. Goes out to the robots and the Scott, it’s the Gav and to the Julia long time. 101.1 MSX FM in your manor. Right across the border, your time rude boys, yeah out to the email crew, msxfm@movingshadow.com , direct link up with us, phone line crew 0 double 7 47 114 553 yeah show dedication, all across Liberty, all Liberty City massive, south east north and the west, yeah spread it across the airwaves sound of the 101.1 killin the other stations dead, the Liberty City’s finest, It’s live! The groove that sounds the best MSX FM no contest. SHOW THEM MISTA TIME CODE!
I had the luck/privilege of being in the UK back in the 90s, around the time Jungle and Drum and Bass were really high (pun intended). Those were the good old times with PlayStation arriving, Wipeout having a superb soundtrack, and many excellent artists providing tunes for games.
In case there are people interested in DnB have a look at Andy C ;-)
There was a club in London that I used to go to in the mid-90s called Complex. It had three floors, one was drum&bass, one techno, and the top floor was PlayStations.
The PS1 was a real zeitgeist moment where gaming came of age.
I remember Gran Turismo well. The Quest Mode theme from Tobal no. 1 goes unmentioned. It's just a short break looped over and over again. After playing this game, you realize if you like jungle or not.
AFD's soundtrack is interesting because it tends to be superficially EDM-ish but still pulls in that jungle influence. Track 2 on that playlist is a perfect example: you have a very standard drum beat front and center, but you also have a heavily-chopped drum beat as texture from the very first moment. The resulting syncopated effect with the piano and synth cords is a nice touch (especially in that bit around the 2 minute mark, which itself is a nice introduction to a broader motif throughout the rest of the soundtrack, particularly the finale Track 24 - which itself is another great example of that "EDM main beat with jungle-like chopping as texture" style).
Occasionally that style flips around, though. Track 15 is a good example, where it's the chopped beat (albeit not severely) that takes front and center, yet again producing neat syncopated effects with the synth chords now in the more rigid role. Similar deal with Tracks 8, 10, and 13, though most of these are less afraid to move the chords into the off-beats.
And then there's my second-favorite track, Track 11, which deemphasizes the chopped drums a bit but instead chops up the synth arpeggios for the same effect of adding that nice bit of texture to the pulsing beat and soaring synths.
My favorite track, Track 7, alternates between a very pure-jungle sound across the board (with the drums and chords being heavily chopped and syncopated, often in support of nice long notes) and brief moments of that EDM-like pulse, to great effect.
And of course there's plenty of great stuff outside of that EDM/jungle hybrid, like Track 23's Harold-Faltermeyer-esque "Top Gun Anthem" knockoff, or the smooth-jazz-ish segues like Track 22.
All in all, a fantastic body of work that defined my childhood.
I only had to read the title and immediately knew what the article was about: that breakbeat soundtrack you could hear in countless original Playstation games.
I don't know much about Jungle music, but I do know a lot about video games, and I want to shout out the Neo Geo game Shock Troopers. One of the best top down run and gun games ever made, and I'm told it has a Jungle/DnB soundtrack.
jungle & drum and bass were magical in the 90s. The breakbeats left so much room for crazy experimentation with synthesizers that you didnt really get out of other genres with the more familiar booming 4 on the floor kick drums. This was also a time when people were moving from hardware to software for music production so the evolution of the music, if you were to look at it from the early 90s to early 2000s was incredible.
What a nice writeup. I've listened to jungle and related styles on and off over the years but I wasn't aware the music had played such a big role in 90's game music!
most of this article is nostalgia. the reason game development use sampled music was because it was always about cutting cost, specially at Sony when they introduced CD audio to games.
And the impact of Jungle in the last few months of 2024 in K-pop
(They discovered two step garage earlier in the year, now they've moved on to jungle. I look forward to them discovering UK dubstep from before Skrillex)
Search youtube for "new kpop 2024 november week 1" and work your way back. Bebe Yana is probably the most "what if I just did jungle?" of the lot, but it's made its way into pretty much all the mainstream groups (even if, because of how the kpop formula works, it's only a chorus section after a drop)
One of the first things I asked ChatGPT when I got access:
could you write a song in the style of a uk drum-n-bass MC about why a fictional brand of study bible, "The Rilla Bibla," is better than others?
Verse 1:
Listen up, listen up,
I got a story to tell
About a brand new study bible that's straight outta hell It's called "The Rilla Bibla,"
and it's the real deal
Got all the wisdom, all the knowledge, it's the bomb, it's for real
Chorus: The Rilla Bibla, it's the one and only
Got all the beats and rhythm,
it's the holy holy
It's got the flow, it's got the style
It's gonna elevate your understanding, mile by mile
Uhhh throwback to simpler times <3 I loved the scene in Basel back in the days
For the adventurous Ishkur also has a nice opinionated guide through the history of electronic music with much of its facets: https://music.ishkur.com/
I used to run a Jungle night, and once we booked Paradox to play. He brought his entire Amiga set up and we had to replace the decks with it for his set. He had to load each track from a floppy disk and it took like 2-3 mins whilst the beat of the previous track would play out and the crowd waited for the next track to load. Crazy seeing a whole dancefloor chilling waiting for a floppy disk to load up!
A real turning point for The Prodigy turning it from a producer-driven dance act into a proper band with a lead singer. Flint created a job in the act for himself not once but twice.
As someone who was so non-conformist in the 90s that he refused to listen to the music for non-conformists, I am constantly surprised that jungle doesn't sound the way it's named. Every time I expect EDM with Afro-Caribbean percussion, like bongos and steelpans and marimbas, realize it's nothing like that and promptly forget what jungle sounds like until the next revelation.
Some rough mixes here and there (especially the first one) because it was live from a NYE event. But it suits the style of music, that era was so raw and fresh, the future was being invented right there! Very happy days :)
1) DJ SS - Intro
2) Higher Sense - Cold Fresh Air
3) Deep Blue - The Helicopter Tune
4) Roni Size - Time Stretch (93 Mix)
5) DMS & The Boneman X - Sweet Vibrations
6) Engineers Without Fears - Spiritual Aura
7) Omni Trio - Soul Promenade
8) Codename John - Kindred
9) Brainkillers - Screwface
10) Dubtronix - Fantasy (Remix)
11) M-Beat - Incredible
12) DJ Rap - Your Mind (Gimp/Steve Mix)
13) Asend & Ultravibe - What Kind Of World
14) LTJ Bukem – Horizons
15) Bruck Wild - Silent Dub
[1] https://on.soundcloud.com/WjQVyJRfYMyQLP3f8
I've been told by several Gen-Z that they've never been to a "rave", and I feel sorry for them. In my town, we had quite the underground scene, but then times changed and it is so much smaller now. Now, "kids" just call it all EDM instead of the specific genre that we know and love.
There's a night in London called Cartulis (which is usually at Fold), when I go there it feels very much like the early rave scene to me (this is just one example, of course). I think there's a tendency when we get older to not be as exposed to the bubbling undercurrent of music, so it's easy to just say "it's not as good as it used to be", but that would be a mistake imho. It's there if you look for it.
I feel like with each new wave of music technology, people basically search the space for a while until the fruitful sub spaces are identified.
The novelty of the exploration is what is there the first time and not there in the future. You don’t know what’s going to sound good until someone happens to bump into it. You get surprises.
no, you got your trance in my drum-n-bass.
that new wave of technology meant that anyone with access to warez could create music for $0 instead of the thousands on buying synths and samplers. no more renting a truck to haul that gear to a gig; now it's just a laptop and/or tablet. new choons level achieved
Mixing and production are worlds better and musicianship has improved compared to where it was for genres where people care about musicianship, but the actual music is mostly either painfully derivative or actively worse because it's trying too hard to be "different."
Modern metal is amazing compared to the stuff from the 90s though.
But for example techno and house these days have such a gargantuan amount of variety. And because those genres were digital-ish to begin with, they didn't suffer as much from the evolution of DAWs compared to some other genres.
This would have done well at a 90s rave (especially from 4:45 onward): https://open.spotify.com/track/5v2NmAWURnM260nd2acPLr
I guess for "90s" Metal it strongly varies how much studio backing there was and if it is early or late 90s. Late 90s sounds great: https://open.spotify.com/track/0JBQnLKfLXmlkquabLtAgd?
Three related playlist:
- Very underground 90s Hip-Hop cuts: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1LhtrTYYMKu8G33paRWFIL
- Rave-y Techno: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/7ktoUGruqYdoY3vLhDDtaB
- All sorts of Metal with melodic elements: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1Wec2pdudcDyIHvOu4fL7b
Using metal as an example; the 80’s and 90’s as an example had several distinct vibrant scenes, Bergen’s Black Metal, Gothenburg’s Melodeath, Tampa Bay’s Death Metal, as examples. All distinct and vibrant with a period of sustained development with a cluster of artists who seemed to circulate and work off each other.
Today it feels easier to connect with others globally with music genres we like, but it’s almost as if this homogenises the art we produce in a sense.
A core collection of 20-40 artists and musicians working and operating in isolation (comparative to now), sharing what they enjoy, spinning it and innovating it to something new.
To genericise it and bring it back to the core of this place - In a sense one relate these scenes in a way to areas with a particularly strong start-up scene, albeit more freeform and wholly artistic in their endeavours.
Long gone are the days of "shoes in the dryer" mixes where guys were just slamming two DATs together with no pitch control. Sadly, I think we've gotten to the point of those tight mixes being less of the skill of the DJ and the result of software. With everything being done on laptops with cool software, I really wonder how many DJs are even mixing and just performing while a premixed file plays.
But as you say, the production quality has definitely improved. The music is just clean with no quality loss from layering/multi-tracking/bouncing. The concept of the space between notes has never been so distinguished.
No. If you are in a serious electronic music scene, nobody is playing premade mixes off their ipods. All the clubs I go to only have just an upgraded version of the same CDJs that were being released in the early 2000s. We mix tracks we bought on sites like bandcamp and beatport on professional equipment. The crowd is educated and would throw someone out of the whole scene if they actually started playing a premade mix.
Those people who fake it make social media videos that go viral with people who spend their time online and have never been to a real rave or underground club (or who go to commercial EDM events - which are not representative of the booming underground) - nobody in the scene actually listens to that stuff and theres a lot of us. None of them would ever get booked at a serious event.
And, for the record, there is a boatload of very talented, super attractive female DJs in the scene and they DJ manually. Most of the vinyl only Djs that I've seen live were female and they weren't ugly either to make up for their femaleness. I know you think a woman can only be talented if she hides her distracting attractiveness.
Check your ignorance when you're clearly not in the loop of the scene.
I know what you mean but Metallica, Pantera, and Emperor (black metal) are still all-time classic staples in my discography.
This is your own fault for going to EDM/house/trap parties. Go to better parties, then you'll find better music.
I enjoy Berlin minimal techno but it's not exactly popular.
The key word is GOOD. Not that you just go places bro. You're clearly unsatisfied with the music you're hearing at these events. SO FIND BETTER ONES.
https://soundcloud.com/kmyle/kmyle-empire-bns089?si=0ce480e4...
https://soundcloud.com/kmyle/kmyle-cocoon-original-mix?si=73...
https://soundcloud.com/hate_music/premiere-introversion-sea-...
https://soundcloud.com/regalmusic/regal-undisputed?si=a6bdf3...
https://soundcloud.com/darko-esser/darko-esser-zondag-2008?s...
https://soundcloud.com/hate_music/premiere-wtchcrft-new-frie...
https://soundcloud.com/hate_music/premiere-marco-bailey-trai...
You're right, minimal techno is not the most popular form of techno right now. That's not a new thing that happened in this decade though. Techno has been going through trends of being faster and more maximalist vs slower and minimalist since it began. I'm sorry that you're struggling to find minimal techno nights to your liking, I'm sure there are some out there and I'm sure the trend will come back around. But the techno of my generation is not all EDM or trap influenced so I know you're talking out your ass. You may have been to many techno events in your life, but what you're saying here just proves you're out of the loop like many nostalgic oldheads. So maybe just take a step back and consider that you may have lost touch with the underground. You certainly have if you think drumcode is an underground reference these days.
If I have to go to a club in new york or berlin to hear music it's not culturally relevant. The stuff you linked gets zero play at festivals.
Edit: Festivals have never been the beating heart of the techno scene my friend. I'm sorry to break it to you. And again, I've been to good festivals which do play this stuff - you clearly don't know where to go and you're taking it out on my generation when its on YOU.
Eh, I've still got a lot of time for 80s/early 90s thrash. Megadeth mostly, it must be said.
I'm constantly listening to new music, and I've come up with lots of new tracks that will make a helluva set list, one day. Problem I have is only owning 1200s, and none of the gear to let those drive digital files. My discretionary funds for gear has evolved into other things so buying the right equipment gets pushed lower on the priority list
Europe is a given but I hear Asia is popping off too. I have friends in Oceania who do some work around the scene. Really it's all over the world, people never stopped partying it just goes a little more underground here and there
I'll reraise you any decent size college town in the US as well.
Heck, I'm in Iowa and there's plenty of raves in the middle of nowhere here.
I think I'm at the age where I'm more interested in participating as someone actually creating part of the entertainment if I'm going to feel like I'm having the best time though, I think that's probably the best way for anyone to get into it. Lots of volunteer opportunities at festivals and of course paid gigs you can do. If you're a programmer, maybe getting deep into visuals is a way you can have some fun contributing too.
There are raves happening in warzones and even places you think there would be authoritarian crackdowns like China
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp2qB9qXJ1w
As an oldster who has only recently gotten into edm, I am clue free on where to begin finding anything underground and mainstream venues suck.
With dB festival gone, do people just hit up showbox or monkey loft shows and try to make friends?
Here in Western Australia there still seems to be a “Bush Doof” party scene. I’m way to old to know the details of that though.
I don't think there were any available in my hometown (or they were too underground for me to have ever heard about!), and there wasn't much exposure to electronic music at all, so it's not an experience I'd ever considered trying to find out how to have.
Just one person's anecdote, of course, but I wonder what the balance of generation vs. location is!
Per TFA, most of my exposure music that's now put under the EDM umbrella was through video games (DDR...). Also mix-discs curated from Limewire downloads, keygens, Windows Movie Maker AMVs, and the Newgrounds/Youtube/Bandcamp releases of amateur FruityLoops producers.
I suppose what might make this paradigm interesting to consider is that it means most of this music was a contributing element to some larger project, and not just something to enjoy on its own (though you could make the case that music at a rave is just a means to forging social and emotional connections). As such, there are a lot of songs that people my age will recognize immediately, and absolutely could not tell you who made them (just where they heard it first).
As a jungle fan since the 90s, don't spout that offensive nonsense ;)
Seriously, there are marked differences between the two other than BPM that make them sound very distinctive (and D&B typically boring to me as a result) - generally, jungle is heavily syncopated and makes more uses of chopped samples vs D&B which tends to be sequenced fairly straight and makes more use of programmed drums.
Nah.
Blasphemy!
I know the artist that made the image* used for the inside jacket for the Prodigy says it wasn’t about rave culture, but it’s still one of my favorite counter culture images.
* https://i.pinimg.com/originals/6c/54/ff/6c54ff7df285244d2d56...
Sorry for the Pinterest link. It was the first one to pop up in search
Tell me you're American without telling me you're American.
With my experience as a Polish Gen Z member, gentrification has only made raves MORE popular in here in A.D. 2024.
Bored kids out of good homes, eh...
Biggest hit: Rocking steady - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V5xlLs-OQY
I also cannot get this track he made for a 1998 video game out of my head:
Tremors - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUKno5p9U04
For example Pete Cannon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1eA-FGJ8B0
More recent livesets using dual Amigas, from the Amiga Junglism channel:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHPIxrcjKW4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1P6VxIWFl7g
Some mixtapes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NjqNwHidpk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe3jEA7710s
I didn't expect a jungle setlist while browsing HN — bless
I didn't ever expect to post one! :D
Thanks for all the great tunes!
One of the things I noticed with a bunch of the younger producers is that they make really nice tunes but they don't bother with the whole intro/outro thing so there's no buffer on either end of the track to mix the thing unless you go add them yourself before even attempting to get them in with a bunch of older choons meant for mixing. like this is great [1], but 1:34 minutes lmao what? On the other hand people who have been at it since the very early days are still quietly releasing alot, here's some secret dillinja cuts [2]
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M77SxLGAxWg
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfyHx7SCn3g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrR82XLCKq8
https://soundcloud.com/paullouth/paul-louth-jungle-mix-nye-2...
https://youtu.be/9hJ4OROIvxY
...and as a bonus, have this 'n all...
https://youtu.be/HImPRflyyJk
...and as it's a Wednesday, have this as a freebie:
https://youtu.be/M_tKjqUK5lM
Thanks for sharing your mix!
Anyway to avoid app install?
https://soundcloud.com/paullouth/paul-louth-jungle-mix-nye-2...
[1] https://potenzadsp.com/plugins/amigo/
[2] https://www.instagram.com/p/C0Pf1bNPgWy/?hl=en
[3] https://www.youtube.com/@TheBizzyBScience
[4] https://www.youtube.com/@groovining
[5] https://www.youtube.com/@STRANJAH
For anyone needing an excellent subwoofer, check out RSL Speedwoofer 10e ($299) or 10s. What a world of difference a good sub makes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9-p06yiJ6Q (Wheels on the bus)
https://youtu.be/vDZHEAwDAVo?feature=shared
The very best of jungle was "UK Apache with Shy FX - Original Nuttah". It got a bit of re-release for its 25th birthday (5 years ago) with an intro by Idris Elba.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GclYmrvWyuY
Ali G gave jungle a moment to shine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efgIm9YPZvE
And jungle isnt dead its just evolved a bit! Nia Archives - Off Wiv Ya Headz from last year:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrnDC94_Tic
Amen brother, Amen!
Genuinely glad I got to experience so much of it growing up with a PS1 and the genre's stuck with me. If you want to focus on listening or have some soothing background noise, it's perfect, versatile.
While not all jungle, shouout to PS1 racing games for their killer soundtracks. The glorified mixtape of Gran Turismo 2 (all versions!), Colin Mcrae Rally's acid beats, everything in Ridge Racer. Really feels like vidya soundtracks peaked there.
A600s, A1200s, maybe others, maybe other versions or variants of protracker, I'm not sure. Anyway, if someone can get through 30s of mix 1 without losing their sh*t, I want to hear about it, I'll keel over.
And, to top it all off, about a week in to these mixes on loop, I ask myself: what is that software? Is that still going? And I discover some fellow called "Olav Sørensen" recently wrote an identical-looking protracker clone:
Which I can confirm runs very smoothly on Arch (btw). It says it's available for Mac and Windows on the site. In the words of the sample from the first track on mix 1: "annihilating the rhythm". Get jungling people!> “That’s the whole point of it, we didn’t want to do sort of boring techno stuff as well, or jungle, so we picked speed garage, it’s funkier than house and garage.”[3]
[1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buck_Bumble
[2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8FQ-N0zb2U)
[3]: https://archive.org/details/64-magazine-15/page/n39/mode/1up
-Can't forget Facing Worlds in Unreal Tournament 1999! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0G6WPuss4
-Andy C will be in Los Angeles Nov. 28 (typically plays LA a few times per year)
-Worth checking out: Modern DJs who mix DnB/jungle with "footwork" (musical genre), e.g. Sharelle https://m.soundcloud.com/iamsherelle
-BBC Radio 1, Radio 6, and Rinse FM all have drum n bass shows and are available for free online and through Alexa etc.
-h2k2 had at least one wicked drum n bass set, I wonder if any of you were there :)
> The techno scene originated in Germany, reached the UK, and it was later associated with the Chicago & Detroit EDM scene in America.
Techno was invented in Detroit, house music in Chicago. Germany like techno. In no sense whatsoever did they invent or originate it.
Fabio and Grooverider are seminal figures to the scene, yes, but they did not originate the sound.
I was AFK all night after posting this, but I actually regret not acknowledging international contributions to techno music and culture, which was and is huge.
But I can't agree with this:
> Where it comes from is defined by where you draw a line in the sand.
There was a time before anyone called music 'techno', and a time after. That's the line, and the part of history which crossed that line happened in the Detroit Metro area. There's no disputing this.
Techno parties are all about having a good time and welcoming everyone, no matter who they are or where they're from. The music is absolutely a blend of influences from all over, and Germans took to it (hard!) for a reason. But roots is roots.
Both Chicago house and NYC/NJ Garage house developed in the early to mid 80s, whereas techno (as a term as well as a cohesive sound) didn't become a thing until the late 80s.
To be clear, I'm not trying to downplay the absolutely massive importance of the Belleville Three at all. But I would consider Juan Atkins' early work to be electro, rather than techno. And meanwhile Kevin Saunderson's best songs always felt more house-like than techno to my ear.
Anyway, jungle's most immediate predecessor was UK breakbeat hardcore, which combined breakbeats from funk and hip hop, with synth influences from acid house (Chicago) and new beat (Belgium), among other house-derived genres. I guess I just don't hear much of a techno influence in early jungle. In my view, that doesn't come in until some slightly later drum and bass subgrenres like techstep.
That all said, definitely agree that the timeline described in the article (which gave credit to Germany and the UK) is just plain wrong.
[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Belleville_Three
wikipedia has a whole section on it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_dance_music#Termino...
also funny how you can beat the game as a dolphin flying a plane haha
who remembers Ojuice.net?
Feeling oldie. :)
Twenty eight years!
I’m ashamed of myself.
https://gta.fandom.com/wiki/Moving_Shadow
For those interested I can highly recommend the "Moving Shadow Sampler Series" mix anthology [0]
[0] https://www.discogs.com/label/396717-Movingshadow-Sampler-Se...
Add these to the list...
Saint Etienne - The Sea (PFM Mix): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1JrnoEbQDE
Funky Technicians - Airtight (Original) (1996): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwC43QSY94A
I had heard some techno and eurodance was popular at the time, but the sounds coming out of the speaker at the store where the demo ran was on another level.
Bought the CD and listen to it every now and then, and Orbital's Petrol track is still up there on my top 100 list.
There was something raw, and edge, that seems lost in so much electronic music these days.
[1]: https://www.discogs.com/release/6385-Various-Wipeout-2097-Th...
https://coldstorage.bandcamp.com/album/wipeout-the-zero-grav...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTIrUXYLtpA
https://youtu.be/O7TklQTeuSE
[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8aa1N9Vcfc
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOIF7iUn-Z8
set was magical
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5JibYKhC4GaAZXoDypqyAm
I still listen to the UT99 soundtrack when I need to concentrate on something.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0G6WPuss4
For easy listening jungle/Drum N Bass, excellent for work, search for "atmospheric drum n bass" or "liquid drum n bass". Artists: Photek, LTJ Bukem, DB (some), etc. Best atmospheric mix w vocals ever: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAXnFZ3anlE
For a tour of jungle over time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgK8h9xRFls
For a famous jungle dj/vocalist pairing: AK1200 moonshine over america https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqRNrhQvYEc
Also, you may recognize Goldie, a pioneer of the genre, who turned actor, turned model, and more recently launched a record label
If you were part of the rave scene, you should watch the whole film, it's full of comedy and nostalgia of those hedonistic times. One of my all time favourite films.
Didn't pirate radio broadcast from boats predate Jungle by about 20 years?
Tundra is a masterpiece:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-G01DKEig14
Not sure I would class it as jungle though.
cool boarders 2 come to mind
Does HN have any advice on how to get started with synthesizers, with an eye towards creating a game soundtrack?
https://learningsynths.ableton.com/
For a more advanced set of lessons there is Syntorial, which has a demo including the first 20 or so lessons and the full set of 200 lessons for $120. Syntorial requires a download, but it's a full synthesizer with lessons built into it, so you can use it in your own music.
Aside from that I'd say youtube is the best source. While you're still a beginner I'd recommend avoiding any videos where they don't show the finished result because it's much harder to tell if the video is BS or not.
For free synthesizers, I'd recommend "TAL U-NO-60" as a good beginner one, it's modeled after the Roland Juno 60. And "Vital" for a more complex / less beginner friendly one. Both of those have paid versions with additional features but those additional features are not necessary at all. You'll also need a DAW software capable of loading VST plugins to use them.
I started the first way in the early 80s and did the second and have a life long love of synths ( I don't even know how many I have now but probably around 30-40 hardware synths, samplers and drum machines).
I fell down the synthesizer rabbit hole during covid. And the urge to acquire more hardware is real. Resist! Try not to chase synth youtube gear cycles. Remember, synthesizers make sounds, not music. Not that there's anything wrong with enjoying sound design, it is fun. But if your goal is to make music, it can be a trap.
> Does HN have any advice on how to get started with synthesizers.
For me, synthesizers didn't click until I got my first super basic knob-per-function synth. There was just so many things I didn't know, that a VST like Vital had way too many options. Once I figured out most synths are just oscillators -> mixer -> filter -> amp, plus envelopes and LFO's for modulation... I could use pretty much any synth.
Here is Wendy Carlos explaining the above concepts in under 4 minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SBDH5uhs4Q
Once you understand those basics, maybe look at videos that show you how to recreate famous sounds. Probably start with simple classic sounds so you get a feel for how the synthesizer controls shape that sound.
Here is Anthony Marinelli showing you the bass sound from Madonna's Holiday in under 8m. He does a good job explaining why you use a certain setting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVedA7H4qpQ
My last piece of advice: the online synth community can be a bit toxic <cough>reddit</cough>. Ignore them and just do what feels fun. It's a hobby after all!
I did this and know other devs who did this in the early 2000s lol.
Software route: Get a midi controller with plenty of knobs and buttons that is supported for easy use by whatever DAW you want (digital audio workstation). By easy use, I mean that there is a config available within the DAW that will map the controller's buttons/knobs etc.to functions within the DAW. Examples: Push 3 or Launchkey keyboards for Abelton, Komplete Kontrol, etc.
If you want a lighter synth that is paired with a sequencer, drum machine, and effects all-in-one hardware box, for fun on the go or on your couch, you want a groovebox. I like the Novation Circuit Tracks, which has a serious synth under the hood, accessible by PC or a midi controller (Novation Launch Control XL is plug-n-play friendly if you download an addon from their website).
What does this mean? How is software plug-n-play?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Huelsbeck
Maybe I'm nostalgic, but these tunes were amazing. https://youtu.be/7dJrsmt9BOY
Oh, and if you haven't invested 30 minutes of your remaining lifetime listening to Orbital - The Box (Full Version) you are missing a masterpiece.
Here is Orbital's Paul Hartnoll playing with his gear:
https://youtu.be/VjlWypTclec
The game's soundtrack is iconic. Dark Ruins is a favorite: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jbNHgmU1TM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDn7ZDcx9w0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhcqYxogdsU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7RRgGSMmjk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hy69Heb33pg
Soul of the Samurai: https://youtu.be/JAyu7o_t_Ys?si=6RvvXtpsLyxXndCu&t=7190
Ace Combat 2: https://youtu.be/_ylkb5td5K0?si=LJw4bf3JsDilDEnf&t=114
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRMN7GzZ3ic&list=PLE0926B068...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1xneKsFArY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isiVdlz8bDY
It's educational, reference real events and you may have a laugh at the same time ;)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqpa418gcKc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDKpQQ4NoNA
P.S. Let's hang out )
https://www.youtube.com/@zorrovian
While the gameplay (brutal flight sim) wasn’t that compelling to child me, it had a full soundtrack made of multiple genres that lives in my brain to this day, especially “Monk’s revenge”. In fact, I think it was setup so that you could put the disk in a CD player and have it play as an audio disk. No idea if any of it counts as “jungle”, but it’s very much 90’s electronic game music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9c6PPlkvBE&list=PLc3TVNLOqs...
Rock raiders too
Never really liked the CD but there are some unique, weird tracks on there.
[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D94YaTCeZlU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POxdm5dW7wE
The PS1 was a real zeitgeist moment where gaming came of age.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1mC6K5kqZU
[0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CGhBLHfP_M
Aka 'Some dnb tracks' funk goes to 10... ours goes to 11' jungle
AFD's soundtrack is interesting because it tends to be superficially EDM-ish but still pulls in that jungle influence. Track 2 on that playlist is a perfect example: you have a very standard drum beat front and center, but you also have a heavily-chopped drum beat as texture from the very first moment. The resulting syncopated effect with the piano and synth cords is a nice touch (especially in that bit around the 2 minute mark, which itself is a nice introduction to a broader motif throughout the rest of the soundtrack, particularly the finale Track 24 - which itself is another great example of that "EDM main beat with jungle-like chopping as texture" style).
Occasionally that style flips around, though. Track 15 is a good example, where it's the chopped beat (albeit not severely) that takes front and center, yet again producing neat syncopated effects with the synth chords now in the more rigid role. Similar deal with Tracks 8, 10, and 13, though most of these are less afraid to move the chords into the off-beats.
And then there's my second-favorite track, Track 11, which deemphasizes the chopped drums a bit but instead chops up the synth arpeggios for the same effect of adding that nice bit of texture to the pulsing beat and soaring synths.
My favorite track, Track 7, alternates between a very pure-jungle sound across the board (with the drums and chords being heavily chopped and syncopated, often in support of nice long notes) and brief moments of that EDM-like pulse, to great effect.
And of course there's plenty of great stuff outside of that EDM/jungle hybrid, like Track 23's Harold-Faltermeyer-esque "Top Gun Anthem" knockoff, or the smooth-jazz-ish segues like Track 22.
All in all, a fantastic body of work that defined my childhood.
----
Another game conspicuously missing from the discussion is Buck Bumble and its jungle-to-the-max soundtrack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lax-KRVVPfo&list=PLeXmIIlkcO...
bump to the boom to the bump to the bass, bump to the boom to the bumble
(They discovered two step garage earlier in the year, now they've moved on to jungle. I look forward to them discovering UK dubstep from before Skrillex)
Verse 1: Listen up, listen up, I got a story to tell About a brand new study bible that's straight outta hell It's called "The Rilla Bibla," and it's the real deal Got all the wisdom, all the knowledge, it's the bomb, it's for real
Chorus: The Rilla Bibla, it's the one and only Got all the beats and rhythm, it's the holy holy It's got the flow, it's got the style It's gonna elevate your understanding, mile by mile
etc. etc. Golden.
For the adventurous Ishkur also has a nice opinionated guide through the history of electronic music with much of its facets: https://music.ishkur.com/
https://youtu.be/V_akDC1ztXQ?si=wxMOxlfvaN4IRSnw
and this:
https://youtu.be/iD9xk3SDSYc?si=KD5TvSg4UDMb-sh8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2k9eMuRwGw
I used to run a Jungle night, and once we booked Paradox to play. He brought his entire Amiga set up and we had to replace the decks with it for his set. He had to load each track from a floppy disk and it took like 2-3 mins whilst the beat of the previous track would play out and the crowd waited for the next track to load. Crazy seeing a whole dancefloor chilling waiting for a floppy disk to load up!
https://www.ami64.com/product-page/gotek-usb-flash-drive-for...
What's interesting is the firmware everyone uses, FlashFloppy[0].
0. https://github.com/keirf/flashfloppy/wiki
Tempest 2000 was probably more acid house influenced, but there was also a lot of early breakbeat hardcore/jungle tunes in there too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Akf4vQs7R9A&list=PLCDB3A4909...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7dQELIwP0U&list=PLD48C6CD40...
https://www.playdosgames.com/online/jill-of-the-jungle/
https://youtu.be/V_b5-RWOfMo
EDIT: yup it's in TFA, facepalming myself.